Million dollar bitcoin 2025 over under you acknowledge, i i think it's kind of not a good idea to make forecasts like that bit swap is the hottest new way to trade tokens, probably all the top decentralized exchanges.
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Today we have part two of my interview with michael saylor in the first one he established. He believes that bitcoin is the apex asset. The world has ever seen in part two. He's, going to show you why he's.
Thinking on a whole different level from the way most people view bitcoin and he's, also not going to answer one question you've got to see to believe all right guys. Here we go. Let's. Let's. Talk about bitcoin as the apex predator here, uh bitcoin, as the godzilla.
If you will in the story uh what about other altcoinscurrencies? Are you a bitcoin maximalist, or do you think that other altcoinscurrencies have a place and if so, you acknowledge, are there any that pique your interest? You acknowledge my view on this is that that the entire altcoins theory is the theory of a decentralized network where you sacrifice uh speed, and you sacrifice performance and efficiency in order to achieve the characteristic of decentralization and robustness.
Another way to say that is, if i wanted to create a network that would allow for sovereign immortality, i would put it on a altcoins network. So then the question becomes, is you acknowledge? Is there space for more than one network offering sovereign immortality? Well, i mean each altcoins is like a religion.
So what is what is? Bitcoin bitcoin is altcoins asset network optimized to provide for sovereign, immortality of first layer wealth, a bit store of value wealth, digital gold? Okay, are there other forms of sovereign immortality that you might wish to release into the ecosystem as its own religion to live by it?'s got ta, you & # 39.
Ve got to be thinking. I want it to last. A thousand years mean that's. The reason you do it if you wanted to last 10 years, you just create a company. If you want to you acknowledge, if you wanted to do something, you acknowledge that that you could do centrally, but not in the u.
s. You just put an offshore exchange or you, you acknowledge you go and you set up in malta or whatever the reason you're. Creating a altcoins is because you want something to last for hundreds of years, so i think there are other things: privacy providence, you acknowledge uh, maybe maybe some form of license um.
However, you acknowledge, and and by the way uh i mean uh smart contracts, especially d phi, to the extent that you want to pursue any of these um. These um functionalities or use cases with sovereign immortality in mind and to the extent that bitcoin doesn't support them right either.
If it doesn & # 39, t support them in its base layer or through some kind of side chain, then it would make sense to pursue another altcoins. But i would say there's. A lot of people in the altcoins industry that pursue um functionality on top of bitcoin via altcoins network, when, in fact they'd, be more successful if they simply create a centralized application on top of bitcoin yeah.
Like i mean look, you can you can uh provide speedy payments via square cash, app yeah that's, a compliant, centralized layered, two application on bitcoin or you can pursue it via some kind of lightning based wallet.
You acknowledge it's. Also a layer too, and you could try to pursue it via a decentralized double blind. You acknowledge layered solution such that it just floats in cyberspace, outside of the control of any company, ceo or government right and and that that has uh has a potential life, but it's not going to defeat apple pay or square yeah right.
So you have to you, have to figure out what niche or or what addressable market you're pursuing, and then you got to actually do it the right way you have to do it with a truly decentralized altcoins asset network.
It's very hard right. I can. I think that it's, quite certain that bitcoin is a successful decentralized network for store of value. I think that the entire rest of the altcoins industry, i would classify as venture capital they're all pretty much and if you have, if you have an adventurous mindset and if you have venture capital and you wish to pursue those, then it's justifiable, but you need to come back to this observation, which is like it's, not clear to me that you need a completely decentralized network in order to enforce digital property rights like an nft right, you might be able to do That on this you acknowledge a centralized network.
I understand why bitcoin needs to be decentralized because i get it, but you acknowledge it's, not clear to me that you couldn't monetize artwork, you acknowledge using google or amazon as the centralized exchange.
So so you're, going to have to come up with things that require cross-jurisdictional sovereign immortality to to convince me that the underlying altcoins framework is the ideal way to do it. Otherwise, you're, really just a uh, a bitcoin entrepreneur or you're or you're, a altcoins entrepreneur and you're working on some new thing.
You acknowledge with some new technology which may or may not work yeah i mean, i think, really. You acknowledge something. You said that really piqued my interest in another interview i watched that you had done was where you talked about the derivatives market and how bitcoin plays into that.
For me personally, i think that ethereum or maybe cardano or polka dot, uh, probably ethereum - i mean it's, got the first mover advantage. It seems to be a better channel through d5 to move the derivatives market so that not just the elite can trade derivatives, but everybody could get access to that uh.
You acknowledge quadrillion dollar estimated quadrillion dollar market. Where do you see bitcoin versus another decentralized network? In terms of bringing the you acknowledge the the derivatives market, because i mean you mentioned 100 trillion dollar market cap for bitcoin uh through derivatives, i believe on one video.
What what is your viewpoint? I think that uh there's. A lot of you acknowledge uncertainty if not regulatory peril, of trying to get into into derivatives trading on altcoins asset networks, because it's, a regulated area, and so you can trade derivatives on the cme, yeah right, yeah and uh, and you can trade Derivatives on centralized exchanges - you can try all you acknowledge all sorts of exchanges right and they're all subject to regulators, so you acknowledge like uh.
Do you need uh defy in order to trade derivatives? No, you don't. I mean there's, ways to trade derivatives right now. I think that um, you acknowledge, bitcoin is property and it's, legal to own property, yeah in the us and in europe, and so it's.
There's, certain clarity to owning something like that. It's been normalized as property by the irs and by the sec and by the occ. I think that, as you get into all these other areas, stable coins defy uh privacy.
They're all aspirational goals; they just have a lot more uncertainty with regard to technology regulation you acknowledge and how they'll, be interpreted across jurisdictions and that's. What creates the risk? So you acknowledge you acknowledge you.
You pursue all those things at your own peril. Yeah well, ethereum, mostly also has been, you acknowledge, declared not a security by the sec. I mean there's. There's. A little uh ambiguity there. If i remember correctly, where in in one case, there was president and then there was another that it was a little more ambiguous, but that's, why? I think that you acknowledge bitcoin, we're, going to run into a problem with the scarcity being too much i mean if you look at how much you guys are buying how much grayscale is buying, how much square is buying, how much other funds Are buying uh there's like a billion dollar or uh.
I can't remember what the number is. A crazy number that some you acknowledge, company from abu dhabi is, is going to be purchasing, and so eventually we're, going to run into the scarcity problem because of the stock to flow, and things like that.
But ethereum to me seems to be like the next place, where a lot of that institutional and corporate wealth will be flowing into. I can't really see. I i i can't see. There is a scarcity problem i mean like.
I don't even acknowledge what that means. Right, i mean there's. No scarcity problem, you have, i mean bitcoin has enough bitcoin to support all 7.8 billion people and absorb 250 trillion dollars of monetary energy.
There's. No lack of competition - you don't think individually is going to get hard to buy because you acknowledge like if you look at the newly minted supply like right now, there's 900 being made a day just between the top four Companies buying bitcoin right now they're buying 2 000 per day, uh ju on average.
It may even be more than that now so i mean they're dipping into the circulating supply. We acknowledge that circulating supply gets down. You acknowledge it's. Gon na get hard to buy it's exponentially easier to buy and the price is going up.
Yeah like, for i mean like it's. For you to say there's, a scarcity problem, it's kind of like saying. Well, there's, a number one through 21 and i'm afraid that we & # 39, ll run out of numbers and we're, trying to divide the numbers, one through 21 between everybody, the human race and the Answer is fractions right.
There's, infinite divisibility right. All you've got is mathematical integrity, and so so, if the, if the human race decides that it's, going to store its value in bitcoin, then creating 37 million alt altcoins doesn't solve the problem.
You're, just talking about counterfeiting, 37 million fake currencies and and that's, just inflation right. So so no you don't need ethereum to store value right. I mean bitcoin solves the problem of store of value.
Yeah right it solves it permanently and and and scarcity is just a synonym for conservation of energy, which is a synonym for mathematical integrity, which is a synonym for arithmetic yeah right. So so you acknowledge if i say that the laws of the universe, you acknowledge, respect the principles of mathematics as described by isaac, newton and the conservation of energy, and that's.
Bitcoin. That's, not a problem right. That's. The solution to the problem at the point that there is like it's like self manifesting. You acknowledge it's like through that it proves it's worth. Basically, i guess it's, a good way to look at it, yeah, so, okay, okay, so it's very interesting um.
I i would say i understand what you're saying, and i agree with you on the underlying principle, but i & # 39. Ll also say that when you look at corporations who would be wanting to add, you acknowledge altcoinscurrency to their balance sheet.
Obviously, bitcoin primarily when you acknowledge the having keeps the supply getting cut and getting cut. Eventually, it's, going to be hard to buy a thousand bitcoin over the counter. The numbers are just going to be so insane and i understand what you mean growing up, then it is going up.
But why do you think companies are having they're irrelevant there's, 21 million bitcoin and that's, simply the conservation of energy. The number could be anything. The most important thing is that you have conservation of energy and when everybody on earthly concern uses bitcoin, the price of bitcoin is going to be higher.
There's. Nothing there's, not a problem with it, right that what what you see is that that more energy is flowing into the system. If you put 10 trillion into the system, you'll divide that by 21 million and the price of bitcoin will be 500 000 a coin.
And when you put 100 trillion in the system, you & # 39. Ll divide that by 21 million and the price will be 5 million a bitcoin, and when you put it a quadrillion into this system, it & # 39, ll, be 50 million.
You acknowledge it's irrelevant it's. Just a number right i mean in that particular case: everybody gets bitcoin at the price they deserve right. You, you, don't like that. That's, a good that's, a good asset network in order to store wealth right.
What you need is conservation of energy and you're right. The people that come into the network first are going to benefit versus those people that bought bitcoin at a dollar, doing pretty good right now, instead of having to pay 50 000.
But you acknowledge the price will just keep going up so that the supply is always equal to the demand and the liquidity trading in the market is just going to keep advancing and as liquidity advances. It's, going to attract progressively larger companies, and then you acknowledge small municipalities and then states, and then governments and institutions and the like, and that can go on forever.
Wow, you can, you can divide 21 million and you acknowledge: buy a hundred million satoshi's, a bitcoin. It's. Gon na work, just fine yeah you're. It sounds like you're playing 21 million d chess, that's. What it sounds like right now, you're.
You're on a whole, another wavelength, uh with where you think this is going. You truly do believe, bitcoin is, is godzilla and that countries are going to adopt it and that's. That's really refreshing to hear the number two biggest owner of bitcoin in terms of corporations.
Ceo ben here's. What i think, i think it's, the first trillion dollar brand in the history of the world, at least the one created by man. If you, if you discount the us dollar, some people say the dollar is the greatest brand.
But after the dollar, bitcoin is a trillion dollar monetary network. It grew from zero to a trillion dollars in 12 years that's faster than google, which took 22 years to get to a trillion in market capital.
So it's, a trillion dollar network. It's, a proof-of-work network. If you look at other altcoins asset networks that purport to be a store of value, the next best one is a hundred times smaller ethereum's, not even committed to being a a proof-of-work network.
They're, converting it into proof-of-stake network. So if you're, looking at a proof-of-work network, you & # 39. Ve got to go all the way to like bitcoin cash and what you have is you have one network which is 100 times bigger than the next best one? It's, 97 dominant.
You acknowledge as a proof-of-work altcoins asset network. So that being the case, it seems quite clear that it's won that battle. It is the bank in cyberspace. If you want to deposit your wealth and uh - and it is the it is - the overwatching brand there's, no reason why we wouldn't expect it to continue to be the brand of long-term store value, wealth or base layer wealth For hundreds of years i love it, i mean i, i think the one takeaway that everybody should have from this is uh.
When we colonize mars and we're trading with aliens, we're, going to be trading bitcoin. I think hopefully the aliens take bitcoin, but the last question i want to ask you: michael, is uh. I'm going to give you a year, and i want to acknowledge over under if you think bitcoin would be a million dollars by this year.
Million dollar bitcoin 2025 over under you acknowledge, i i think it's kind of not a good idea to make forecasts like that. Yeah, okay, you can't. You can't say where you think it's going to okay, i i i can dig it michael.
I tell you over the long term. I expect it to flip gold, and that takes it to 500 000, and i expect it to march progressively toward a hundred trillion dollar market cap, which is which is the value of all of the treasury assets, or at least at least a decent.
A decent order of magnitude of the treasury assets in the world and bitcoin is the ideal treasury asset network, so it should march toward that, with with you acknowledge, a degree of progression, pretty good ease and uh.
That would be five million dollar bitcoin, and i think that's, probably that's. It's interesting. You mentioned that, because that's kind of the number i've, looked at and said when it gets to that number it could stabilize, and you acknowledge obviously the more wealth that flows into it: the harder it's.
Going to be to move and over time it will get a little more stability. I think so, but michael thank you so much for joining us today. It's, definitely been a really great interview. I definitely want to have you on again down the road uh.
Maybe when bitcoin starts climbing up a lot higher, we can get. You get your thoughts on that. I certainly wish you guys at microstrategy good luck with uh trying to trying to add more bitcoin as much as you can.
I hope audience definitely got something out of. Is there anything you want to leave us with today? Um thanks for having me absolutely all right, michael thanks for joining us everybody. Let us acknowledge what you think down below that's.
All we got be blessed good boy, [, Music, ] out, [, Music ], you